And maybe this of interest too, the Russian gunners were certainly not lacking in training
Re: Russian battalion guns in 1807?
To : Steven H. Smith, Hans-Karl Weiss, Jean Tessier
Some notes (my translation) from .....
HISTORY OF ARTLLERY MATERIEL
Colonel A. NILIUS
Saint Petersburg: P.P. Soikin Typography, 1904
HISTORICAL DESCRIPTION OF THE CLOTHING AND ARMS OF THE RUSSIAN ARMY
Saint Petersburg: Military Typography Office, 1841 - T. VII & T. 10
- 2 regimental guns for each army regiment; in the guard, 8 guns for the Preobrazhenskiy and 6 for the Semenovskiy regiments
- To operate these guns, special commands under an officer were appointed; all ranks were trained in artillery drill; even gun carriages were under construction in the regiments. The artillery department was limited only to casting of peices, and fabrication of shells, charges and cartridges and occasionally — repair of spoiled equipment.
- In dragoon regiments, the artilleriests were mounted on saddlehorses.
- The pieces used were
........ 3-lb guns
........ 1/4-pud (10-lb), 8-lb and 3-lb unicorns (gun-howitzers)
........ 6-lb coehorn mortars.
- The guns from the guard regiments are sent into the new guard artillery batallion.
- The regimental artillery is standardized as 4x 6-lb gun and 2x 10-lb unicorn per regiment. This detachment is palced under the commandof an artillery officer and non-commissioned officers. The guns are distibuted to the commanders of regiments (2 guns and 1 unicorn per batallion).
- Some 3-lb unicorns are retained for some of the newly-formed jäger regiments (May 1797), 2 per regiment (1 unicorn per batallion).
- This is the system for the 1799 campaign.
- 3-lb unicorns are said to remain in service, as a sort of ad hoc sledge and mountain gun, until 1838.
- In late 1800, after the peace, the regimental guns are ordered to be sent into arsenals and garrisons. They are re-issued in 1803, on the same ratio as before, which after the new organization of April 1802 results in 2 guns or unicorns per batallion for the grenadier and musketeer regiments.
- There is no mention of re-issue of the 3-lb unicorns to the jäger regiments.
- The guns are distibuted as artillery companies (all ranks from the artillery) and are put at the disposal of the brigade (2x regiment) commander.
- This is the system for the 1805 campaign.
- The doctrine of regimental artillery is abolished per order of 23.VII.1806 O.S. which (i) groups the artillery companies into artillery brigades composed of ~5 battery ("heavy"), light and horse artillery companies, commanded by an artillery senior officer and (ii) attaches these brigades to same-numbered divisions.
- This is the system for the 1807 campaign.
Some questions that one might ask ....
1. Is there primary source evidence for use of 3-lber unicorns by jägers after the 1799 campaign (excluding in fortified places and in the Caucasus/Siberia/etc.) ? I know of none.
----> Hans-Karl : where is your quote from ? Is it an observation made in 1806 or published in 1806 ?
2. Is there primary source evidence (other than in 1800-1803 when all the regimental guns were collected into arsenals and garrisons) for regimental artillery not being usually "with the regiment" to which it was assigned ? I know of none.
3. Is there any primary source evidence of regimental artillery (artillery broken up into smaller than 1/2-company units and controlled by infantry officers) in Russian service in the 1807 campaign or later ? I know of none.
4. What are the exact orders issued by Kutusov in late 1812 on this subject ? When and how were they implemented, if at all ? When and by whom were they rescinded, if they were ever given ? I have never heard of this at all, and suspect something is being mis-interpreted or even mis-translated. There were several "emergency" organization changes (such as combining the much-reduced regiments in each brigade of the 7th and 8th Corps) after Borodino. Perhaps Kutusov did something unusual becasue of the shortage of men in the ranks, looking to stiffen them with guns until replacements arrived ?